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	<title>Comments on: Love &#038; Marriage</title>
	<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/</link>
	<description>se wo were fi na wosan kofa a yenki</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 22:46:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: RoxyUK</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8735</link>
		<dc:creator>RoxyUK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Apr 2006 08:57:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8735</guid>
		<description>Jason said: "It's my understanding that wives in a polygamous marriage tend to form a coalition."

Yeah sometimes, other times they lie, emotionally torture, withold food and even physically attack each other. Little surprise since it goes against their biological interest to share a male's resources with other females and their children. They will be vying against each other for scarce resources. If the male has a preferred favourite then there will be even more conflict within the group. Hell, Mohammed had to use divine sanction to keep his harem under control when he got jiggy with his new jewish wife. I also read somewhere that child mortality rates rise significantly with polygamy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jason said: &#8220;It&#8217;s my understanding that wives in a polygamous marriage tend to form a coalition.&#8221;</p>
<p>Yeah sometimes, other times they lie, emotionally torture, withold food and even physically attack each other. Little surprise since it goes against their biological interest to share a male&#8217;s resources with other females and their children. They will be vying against each other for scarce resources. If the male has a preferred favourite then there will be even more conflict within the group. Hell, Mohammed had to use divine sanction to keep his harem under control when he got jiggy with his new jewish wife. I also read somewhere that child mortality rates rise significantly with polygamy.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Godesky</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8558</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Godesky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Apr 2006 15:35:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8558</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;But doesn't jealoousy occur in polygamous marriages?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

It's my understanding that wives in a polygamous marriage tend to form a coalition.  Polygamy has fewer relationships involved than polyamory, and is more ideally suited to the differing reproductive drives of humans, which is probably why it implodes less often.  Actually, such female coalitions remind me of bonobo matriarchy....

&lt;blockquote&gt;As for the England reference. I got that in a Royal University class in the SCA. Perhaps the man teaching the class was using poor sources.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Ah, OK.  Given Engels' citation, it's perfectly understandable.  Do you mean SCA, as in the Society for Creative Anachronism?  I was briefly involved with them, but I was terribly disappointed to find that accuracy and scholarship were not their strong suits.

&lt;blockquote&gt;While I admire your scholarship, I am not as careful and thorough in documenting my learning as you are.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Believe me, it's a learned skill--only after a few years of getting beat up for not remembering where you got it do you start to learn to remember where you heard everything you know.  It's no problem, but I don't think we can go much farther without a real example, with a name we can all look up and whatnot.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Yeah. With female jealousy, there tends to be fewer deaths.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Jealous men beat the ever-loving shit out of each other.

Jealous women slowly poison you over a period of years, until you're left at death's door thinking you've simply become chronically ill.  Then, once you've lost the power of speech or movement, they whisper it in your ear so that in those long, last grueling days before you finally expire, you can know exactly what was done to you and why....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>But doesn&#8217;t jealoousy occur in polygamous marriages?</p></blockquote>
<p>It&#8217;s my understanding that wives in a polygamous marriage tend to form a coalition.  Polygamy has fewer relationships involved than polyamory, and is more ideally suited to the differing reproductive drives of humans, which is probably why it implodes less often.  Actually, such female coalitions remind me of bonobo matriarchy&#8230;.</p>
<blockquote><p>As for the England reference. I got that in a Royal University class in the SCA. Perhaps the man teaching the class was using poor sources.</p></blockquote>
<p>Ah, OK.  Given Engels&#8217; citation, it&#8217;s perfectly understandable.  Do you mean SCA, as in the Society for Creative Anachronism?  I was briefly involved with them, but I was terribly disappointed to find that accuracy and scholarship were not their strong suits.</p>
<blockquote><p>While I admire your scholarship, I am not as careful and thorough in documenting my learning as you are.</p></blockquote>
<p>Believe me, it&#8217;s a learned skill&#8211;only after a few years of getting beat up for not remembering where you got it do you start to learn to remember where you heard everything you know.  It&#8217;s no problem, but I don&#8217;t think we can go much farther without a real example, with a name we can all look up and whatnot.</p>
<blockquote><p>Yeah. With female jealousy, there tends to be fewer deaths.</p></blockquote>
<p>Jealous men beat the ever-loving shit out of each other.</p>
<p>Jealous women slowly poison you over a period of years, until you&#8217;re left at death&#8217;s door thinking you&#8217;ve simply become chronically ill.  Then, once you&#8217;ve lost the power of speech or movement, they whisper it in your ear so that in those long, last grueling days before you finally expire, you can know exactly what was done to you and why&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Giulianna Lamanna</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8499</link>
		<dc:creator>Giulianna Lamanna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Apr 2006 01:43:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8499</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Male jealousy is much different from female jealousy.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Yeah. With female jealousy, there tends to be fewer deaths. :-P</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Male jealousy is much different from female jealousy.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yeah. With female jealousy, there tends to be fewer deaths. <img src='http://anthropik.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif' alt=':-P' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: ChandraShakti</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8483</link>
		<dc:creator>ChandraShakti</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Apr 2006 21:23:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8483</guid>
		<description>I'm very sorry, unfortunately I cannot provide specific group names. I saw the documentary on the History Channel, I believe a year or two ago, but I don't recall the tribe's name. They showed what had been filmed some 20 years ago when the ethnographer first visited the group and then how things had changed after 20 years of contact with westerners. I cannot say how long the situation had been stable before then, but they did have interventions to deal with a jealous husband shown.
   As for the England reference. I got that in a Royal University class in the SCA. Perhaps the man teaching the class was using poor sources. If I can find my class notes I may be able to give you the name of the specific group he cited, but I'm not sure. It is likely to be June before I see him again to ask about his sources.
   While I admire your scholarship, I am not as careful and thorough in documenting my learning as you are.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m very sorry, unfortunately I cannot provide specific group names. I saw the documentary on the History Channel, I believe a year or two ago, but I don&#8217;t recall the tribe&#8217;s name. They showed what had been filmed some 20 years ago when the ethnographer first visited the group and then how things had changed after 20 years of contact with westerners. I cannot say how long the situation had been stable before then, but they did have interventions to deal with a jealous husband shown.<br />
   As for the England reference. I got that in a Royal University class in the SCA. Perhaps the man teaching the class was using poor sources. If I can find my class notes I may be able to give you the name of the specific group he cited, but I&#8217;m not sure. It is likely to be June before I see him again to ask about his sources.<br />
   While I admire your scholarship, I am not as careful and thorough in documenting my learning as you are.</p>
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		<title>By: _Gi</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8482</link>
		<dc:creator>_Gi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Apr 2006 20:17:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8482</guid>
		<description>Male jealousy is much different from female jealousy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Male jealousy is much different from female jealousy.</p>
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		<title>By: Vicky</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8478</link>
		<dc:creator>Vicky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Apr 2006 16:22:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8478</guid>
		<description>"Every experiment with polyamory I know of occurs either in someone's imagination (where they can pretend that people will not be affected by things like jealousy)"

But doesn't jealoousy occur in polygamous marriages?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Every experiment with polyamory I know of occurs either in someone&#8217;s imagination (where they can pretend that people will not be affected by things like jealousy)&#8221;</p>
<p>But doesn&#8217;t jealoousy occur in polygamous marriages?</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Godesky</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8395</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Godesky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Mar 2006 20:09:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8395</guid>
		<description>I found where your reference comes from, Chandra.  Friedrich Engels asserted that the "English" (by which he must mean the Anglo-Saxons) practiced "group marriage."  There is no evidence for this.  I found a number of unsubstantiated claims like it.  It seems that the Genesis story's use of "clothing" and the introduction of modesty conditioned Europeans to expect group marriage as evidence of their primitive lack of sexual modesty.

&lt;blockquote&gt;It was believed at the time by a number of authorities, including Frazer, that primitive humanity had practiced some form or other of group marriage. McLennan maintained that brothers would hold a wife in common, while Morgan hypothesized that groups of brothers would marry groups of sisters, and that within this group marriage, individuals would have sex with each other indiscriminately. Both Frazer and Morgan hoped that the Australian ethnographers would find evidence of such an organization among the Aborigines.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

From "&lt;a href="http://www.timothyjpmason.com/WebPages/Publications/Impudeur1.htm" rel="nofollow"&gt;The Anthropologist and the Lady's Maid&lt;/a&gt;."

See also, "&lt;a href="http://anthropik.com/2005/05/the-savage-mirror/" rel="nofollow"&gt;The Savage Mirror&lt;/a&gt;," Giuli's review of Gustav Jahoda's &lt;em&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0415188555/anthropik-20" rel="nofollow"&gt;Images of Savages&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/em&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I found where your reference comes from, Chandra.  Friedrich Engels asserted that the &#8220;English&#8221; (by which he must mean the Anglo-Saxons) practiced &#8220;group marriage.&#8221;  There is no evidence for this.  I found a number of unsubstantiated claims like it.  It seems that the Genesis story&#8217;s use of &#8220;clothing&#8221; and the introduction of modesty conditioned Europeans to expect group marriage as evidence of their primitive lack of sexual modesty.</p>
<blockquote><p>It was believed at the time by a number of authorities, including Frazer, that primitive humanity had practiced some form or other of group marriage. McLennan maintained that brothers would hold a wife in common, while Morgan hypothesized that groups of brothers would marry groups of sisters, and that within this group marriage, individuals would have sex with each other indiscriminately. Both Frazer and Morgan hoped that the Australian ethnographers would find evidence of such an organization among the Aborigines.</p></blockquote>
<p>From &#8220;<a href="http://www.timothyjpmason.com/WebPages/Publications/Impudeur1.htm" rel="nofollow">The Anthropologist and the Lady&#8217;s Maid</a>.&#8221;</p>
<p>See also, &#8220;<a href="http://anthropik.com/2005/05/the-savage-mirror/" rel="nofollow">The Savage Mirror</a>,&#8221; Giuli&#8217;s review of Gustav Jahoda&#8217;s <em><a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0415188555/anthropik-20" rel="nofollow">Images of Savages</a></em>.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Godesky</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8389</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Godesky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Mar 2006 19:16:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8389</guid>
		<description>There have been attempts, and plenty of fictional accounts, but none that have worked out in reality.  We've decided that "jealousy" is "bad," and therefore, something for us to "transcend."  But such dreams of transcendance are always folly, and jealousy has a place in society.  Every experiment with polyamory I know of occurs either in someone's imagination (where they can pretend that people will not be affected by things like jealousy), or ends in the painful implosion of said society, with incredible hostility, regret and pain for all parties involved.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There have been attempts, and plenty of fictional accounts, but none that have worked out in reality.  We&#8217;ve decided that &#8220;jealousy&#8221; is &#8220;bad,&#8221; and therefore, something for us to &#8220;transcend.&#8221;  But such dreams of transcendance are always folly, and jealousy has a place in society.  Every experiment with polyamory I know of occurs either in someone&#8217;s imagination (where they can pretend that people will not be affected by things like jealousy), or ends in the painful implosion of said society, with incredible hostility, regret and pain for all parties involved.</p>
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		<title>By: Vicky</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8387</link>
		<dc:creator>Vicky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Mar 2006 18:41:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8387</guid>
		<description>I read of a fictional culture in which a marriage consisted of two men and two women.  You were allowed to have sex with the same sex person and one of the opposite sex people.  The other opposite sex person was off limits.  Sounds interesting, but I think I prefer monogamy, personally :).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I read of a fictional culture in which a marriage consisted of two men and two women.  You were allowed to have sex with the same sex person and one of the opposite sex people.  The other opposite sex person was off limits.  Sounds interesting, but I think I prefer monogamy, personally :).</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Godesky</title>
		<link>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8368</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Godesky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Mar 2006 03:52:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://anthropik.com/2006/03/love-marriage/#comment-8368</guid>
		<description>Are you talking about the Britons of the LPRIA, or the Anglo-Saxons in Late Antiquity?  Neither case exhibits polyamory.  In fact, both were monogamous cultures--the introduction of Christianity to the Britons under the Roman Empire, and its later re-introduction to the Anglo-Saxons with Augustine of Canterbury, changed a lot of things, but not marriage patterns.

I do know of a number of Central and South American cultures, but none that practice polyamory.  I don't suppose you know the name of the culture?  Your assertion concerning Britain is one I know to be blatantly incorrect, so I'm inclined to not believe you on the second, either, without at least a specific culture to look up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are you talking about the Britons of the LPRIA, or the Anglo-Saxons in Late Antiquity?  Neither case exhibits polyamory.  In fact, both were monogamous cultures&#8211;the introduction of Christianity to the Britons under the Roman Empire, and its later re-introduction to the Anglo-Saxons with Augustine of Canterbury, changed a lot of things, but not marriage patterns.</p>
<p>I do know of a number of Central and South American cultures, but none that practice polyamory.  I don&#8217;t suppose you know the name of the culture?  Your assertion concerning Britain is one I know to be blatantly incorrect, so I&#8217;m inclined to not believe you on the second, either, without at least a specific culture to look up.</p>
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